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eeyu

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PostSubject: Sioux boom   Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:26 am

I know this isnt a recording i probably should have recorded it but i was just wondering if this was a good "boom". open to any comments/riticism/advice.

http://www.filefront.com/15279113/screen1.jpg

my score/army by 40

http://www.filefront.com/15279131/screen2.jpg

I mite do it again when no ones on eso and record it.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Sun Jan 03, 2010 11:01 am

eeyu wrote:
I know this isnt a recording i probably should have recorded it but i was just wondering if this was a good "boom". open to any comments/riticism/advice.

http://www.filefront.com/15279113/screen1.jpg

my score/army by 40

http://www.filefront.com/15279131/screen2.jpg

I mite do it again when no ones on eso and record it.
wheres whitey when we need him?

eeyu, dont listen to anyone here, especially PI. hes the sioux protege of whiteirish supposedly.

sandy might have a goodsioux recording, or heck maybe ill post mine. Surprised
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I.LOVE.GIRLS.GIRLS.GIRLS

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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Sun Jan 03, 2010 3:44 pm

Buck the System wrote:

eeyu, dont listen to anyone here, especially PI. hes the sioux protege of whiteirish supposedly

see, know everybody note that this is buzz randomally picking a fight with PI for no reason(likes hes done with all of us), when this thread was orginally made for help, maybe one of the admin cud DELETE buzz's post(maybe long with buzz) so the new guy doesnt just see fights for his first post..

p.s. one thing PI always had was a really good boom with souix for your info, and PLEASE nobody on this site wants to see your souix boom..
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:54 pm

taddletale, your funny
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Brett

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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:28 pm

Buck the System wrote:
wheres whitey when we need him?

eeyu, dont listen to anyone here, especially PI. hes the sioux protege of whiteirish supposedly.

sandy might have a goodsioux recording, or heck maybe ill post mine. Surprised

BTW your boom is fine if you can do nearly 1600 against the comp on your first shot, so you can safely ignore this post unless you want my way of doing it. The only thing I'd tell you is that the wakina and rifle rider merc cards that improve their stats are mandatory for Sioux's army.

Hi Buzz, love ya honey. But more seriously, my boom/white's differ quite a bit, I took his overall blueprint and changed the thing 20 times over, tweaking it for maximum military at 40 relative to economy.

Also, True_Playa, I didn't really view this as an attack, I took it as sarcasm (probably because I like sarcasm myself).

Build-order vill wise is: distrib to get hunting dogs, get hunting dogs, all food, age to 2 with fast age, 10 food rest coin, new vills to coin until you can age to 3. 16 food, rest wood while aging, get 1st market tech for wood tho, age with 800w.

Gather 500 wood from trees, 2 more to food, build 2 tcs + firepit, max firepit to 25 vills, spam vills to food until 38-40 vills, 4 to wood unless there's no food on the map, then do 10ish minimum. Rest to coin. Build a farm, get the remaining market upgrades for wood-cutting, get the upgrade from the farm. Build a plantation, get the first upgrade from it about the time you finish the first farm upgrade, then continue upgrading from both.

Age with 1.5K food, distribute as needed to age-up faster, age to 5 with bison.

Card order: trickle, 20% food, 20% wood, 20% wood, 15% wood, 15% mill, battlefield construction, new ways, cav combat, 14 wakina + 15% to HP (or whatever that percentage is) after 199 pop, cav dmg/hp, wc attack aura, teepee aura, more teepee, cav trainspeed, cheap cav, from there whatever you want.

1400-1500 is doable on a map like Andes, on Deccan 1600 is doable using that strategy, end distrib should be roughly 35-40K food, 8-10K wood, 15-25K coin. Just practice and practice until it's hammered into memory.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Sun Jan 03, 2010 6:59 pm

lol, then my c. 1450 booms are ok? Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Sun Jan 03, 2010 7:24 pm

Firom wrote:
lol, then my c. 1450 booms are ok? Very Happy

Did I ever say otherwise? Razz

TBH, getting into the flow of combat with Sioux is the most important thing, once you get the eco to 1400ish you just need to learn how their army works and how to exploit it versus all the different civs, then it's not so bad.

Of course, there's still impossible match-up's for Sioux, but I'm saying it's more important to learn how to capitalize on your enemies mistakes quickly than it is to get a 1600 boom every game.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:08 pm

Brett wrote:
Buck the System wrote:
wheres whitey when we need him?

eeyu, dont listen to anyone here, especially PI. hes the sioux protege of whiteirish supposedly.

sandy might have a goodsioux recording, or heck maybe ill post mine. Surprised

BTW your boom is fine if you can do nearly 1600 against the comp on your first shot, so you can safely ignore this post unless you want my way of doing it. The only thing I'd tell you is that the wakina and rifle rider merc cards that improve their stats are mandatory for Sioux's army.

Hi Buzz, love ya honey. But more seriously, my boom/white's differ quite a bit, I took his overall blueprint and changed the thing 20 times over, tweaking it for maximum military at 40 relative to economy.

Also, True_Playa, I didn't really view this as an attack, I took it as sarcasm (probably because I like sarcasm myself).

Build-order vill wise is: distrib to get hunting dogs, get hunting dogs, all food, age to 2 with fast age, 10 food rest coin, new vills to coin until you can age to 3. 16 food, rest wood while aging, get 1st market tech for wood tho, age with 800w.

Gather 500 wood from trees, 2 more to food, build 2 tcs + firepit, max firepit to 25 vills, spam vills to food until 38-40 vills, 4 to wood unless there's no food on the map, then do 10ish minimum. Rest to coin. Build a farm, get the remaining market upgrades for wood-cutting, get the upgrade from the farm. Build a plantation, get the first upgrade from it about the time you finish the first farm upgrade, then continue upgrading from both.

Age with 1.5K food, distribute as needed to age-up faster, age to 5 with bison.

Card order: trickle, 20% food, 20% wood, 20% wood, 15% wood, 15% mill, battlefield construction, new ways, cav combat, 14 wakina + 15% to HP (or whatever that percentage is) after 199 pop, cav dmg/hp, wc attack aura, teepee aura, more teepee, cav trainspeed, cheap cav, from there whatever you want.

1400-1500 is doable on a map like Andes, on Deccan 1600 is doable using that strategy, end distrib should be roughly 35-40K food, 8-10K wood, 15-25K coin. Just practice and practice until it's hammered into memory.

Many thanks, v6 has given me a quick runthrough with their military and icet showed me a few things on the economy. Ive only just seen White's sioux boom today as well as yours. i do need to practise the military side a bit, gotta practise spamming those teepees Very Happy

And if its any consolation to you buzz, your not funny either.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Mon Jan 04, 2010 5:35 pm

eeyu wrote:
Brett wrote:
Buck the System wrote:
wheres whitey when we need him?

eeyu, dont listen to anyone here, especially PI. hes the sioux protege of whiteirish supposedly.

sandy might have a goodsioux recording, or heck maybe ill post mine. Surprised

BTW your boom is fine if you can do nearly 1600 against the comp on your first shot, so you can safely ignore this post unless you want my way of doing it. The only thing I'd tell you is that the wakina and rifle rider merc cards that improve their stats are mandatory for Sioux's army.

Hi Buzz, love ya honey. But more seriously, my boom/white's differ quite a bit, I took his overall blueprint and changed the thing 20 times over, tweaking it for maximum military at 40 relative to economy.

Also, True_Playa, I didn't really view this as an attack, I took it as sarcasm (probably because I like sarcasm myself).

Build-order vill wise is: distrib to get hunting dogs, get hunting dogs, all food, age to 2 with fast age, 10 food rest coin, new vills to coin until you can age to 3. 16 food, rest wood while aging, get 1st market tech for wood tho, age with 800w.

Gather 500 wood from trees, 2 more to food, build 2 tcs + firepit, max firepit to 25 vills, spam vills to food until 38-40 vills, 4 to wood unless there's no food on the map, then do 10ish minimum. Rest to coin. Build a farm, get the remaining market upgrades for wood-cutting, get the upgrade from the farm. Build a plantation, get the first upgrade from it about the time you finish the first farm upgrade, then continue upgrading from both.

Age with 1.5K food, distribute as needed to age-up faster, age to 5 with bison.

Card order: trickle, 20% food, 20% wood, 20% wood, 15% wood, 15% mill, battlefield construction, new ways, cav combat, 14 wakina + 15% to HP (or whatever that percentage is) after 199 pop, cav dmg/hp, wc attack aura, teepee aura, more teepee, cav trainspeed, cheap cav, from there whatever you want.

1400-1500 is doable on a map like Andes, on Deccan 1600 is doable using that strategy, end distrib should be roughly 35-40K food, 8-10K wood, 15-25K coin. Just practice and practice until it's hammered into memory.

Many thanks, v6 has given me a quick runthrough with their military and icet showed me a few things on the economy. Ive only just seen White's sioux boom today as well as yours. i do need to practise the military side a bit, gotta practise spamming those teepees Very Happy

And if its any consolation to you buzz, your not funny either
.
ok boss. about the teepees, they are built faster than anything in the game besides russias building. so its really easy along with the forward building units that makes sioux very strong.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:19 pm

Really easy depends on opponent, when trying to macro and micro + build teepees and they keep getting shot down by 4-5 port mortars you just can't reach with WC/RR (not an uncommon occurrence) Sioux is extremely APM/practice-limited, if you don't have an APM of at least 140-200 and a lot of practice you're gonna get drained hard.

Against an opponent who can't siege them down as fast, Sioux is a relatively low-APM civilization (especially in comparison to British/Iroquois), an APM of 50 will do if your opponent doesn't keep knocking down teepees. Your goal to get to a high-level with Sioux should be 5 teepees placed and building in 7.5 seconds (the fire rate of a mortar) as far as teepee-spam is concerned, this is ignoring microing RR to avoid stupid overkill against Cavalry, macroing Firepit properly to balance train rate, damage, siege and WC health as needed, working WC properly with stealth + pathing and junk, etc.

All those little details can murder you at high levels with Sioux, sorry to say but unless you play them almost exclusively it's very hard to really get to a high level and not loose terribly against players who know how to counter them.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:57 pm

These TLAs sure are confusing Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:58 pm

APM = actions per minute, it's the number of actions (like selecting a unit, training one, micro, etc) you can perform in one minute.

Most professional Starcraft players average in excess of 250, AOE3 supremacy players average around 150-250 (depends on the player), etc. Basically, the lower your APM the less capable you are of quickly multitasking.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:46 am

ahhh. that makes sense
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:42 am

well all i can say is white irish had the best micro i ever play 1v1 ever. for some reason, and i noticed it when i used them, is that no matter how much you try to just fight and push,

the warchief when he gets close enough alot of the units automaticly shot him/or move........pisses me off. then you can just go back and forth and let theier heads spin til they dont know what hit em.

btw, apm means nothing. i cant even believe after posting here forever that you or even anyone would bring that up.......its just ludicris.

youve been playing too many other games to bring that stuff up.

APM is all game dependent, some games you have to multitask furriously, some are slightly lower but that doesnt diminish in any way the games strength.

im still in shock..... Shocked
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:14 pm

then you need to put the mouse down and take a reality check if THAT shocks you..
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 1:51 pm

yep, the fact he brings up APM these days is obvious hes been playing other games or reading.

i dont ever remeber APM ever being a discusion til today.

i looked into this and saw some old 16bit games that are way more APM than even this game, let alone any other game you choose.

APM means nothing and i discredit it as being anything usefull for this game.

brett, what are you playing that would bring you to such a comment?
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 3:38 pm

APM is inherently a part of every RTS, I usually don't mention it because it's not worth mentioning, but lately I've had more time to reflect on the varying "scientific" aspects of AOE3. That is to say, boiling everything down to what mechanics work and what don't, and the contributing factors towards improving at those elements.

To say that APM means nothing is just folly, APM is important in all RTS games whether you consciously realize it or not. Multitasking is impossible with a low APM, thus your skills are extremely limited in supremacy. Micromanagement is harder with a low APM, because it takes more time to do each task required, etc.

Without a high APM (reflexes) you can't achieve anywhere near Major to Lt. Colonel in supremacy, and without experience on top of that you can't achieve anywhere near PR35 or higher in supremacy. The average APM of a Lt in TR is below 150, which is terrible by supremacy standards, and thus why most Lts in treaty are absolute crap (M. Sarge or below) in 1v1 supremacy.

Where-as your average (proper, not noob-basher) Major+ in TR average about 150-200 APM, and with practice could be a PR30+ in supremacy (depending on the players activity, interest, etc, this doesn't usually happen). Of course this varies with player, I'm sure Sanderson's APM is higher than mine, and such.

The reason I'm utilizing this in my posts is because it makes it easier to boil down the skill portions of TR from the things anyone can do, if it requires an APM above a certain level to manage certain aspects of a civilization at high level, it's simply impossible to play them properly at a high level with a lower APM and not be severely disadvantaged.

It also explains the massive differences in skill between a Lt who makes the right units and has a good boom, and a Major+ who makes similar unit choices, has a similar boom, but ends the game with a thorough victory. Due to higher APM, their micro can be better, their higher APM with practiced micro makes up the difference in skill from a purely logical standpoint.

Also, since it runs very well in Wine on Linux, I've been playing Starcraft a fair bit recently, which is why APM is beginning to become more important in understanding the mechanics of AOE3 to me, since it's integral to really understanding skill differences in Starcraft (little bit of C&C RA2, as well). The higher your APM, the better you can multitask, the better you can micro, the stronger you are.

When you think about it, every RTS can be boiled down to those same mechanics, it's just finding where it all fits into the game.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:10 pm

I have APM? Has it spread widely? What are the chances of recovering?
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:22 pm

Sanderson_FIN wrote:
I have APM? Has it spread widely? What are the chances of recovering?

To not be finnish or swedish!
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 9:11 pm

imo, apm is.......get a better comp to handle the game quickly. super fast ram that is a "kit"

better parts means better responsivness. its silly to think a internet connected game has any justication in my view, but its true. APM means nothing online team games with crappy old door stop comps in the game.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Tue Jan 05, 2010 11:10 pm

APM has nothing at all to do with your computer, it has to do with your PHYSICAL capabilities. That is, how fast your hands move, how fast you can type and click and such.

However, lag does adversely affect micro because it increases the time available to do tasks, and thus lowers the APM requirements. In 1v1 lag should be so close to zero that it's irrelevant, in 2v2 for TR it's usually decently close to zero. I don't play 3v3 very often, and in-fact strongly dislike 3v3 anything.
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Wed Jan 06, 2010 2:01 am

Buck the System wrote:
imo, apm is.......get a better comp to handle the game quickly. super fast ram that is a "kit"

better parts means better responsivness. its silly to think a internet connected game has any justication in my view, but its true. APM means nothing online team games with crappy old door stop comps in the game.

He likes to deny what he cannot do Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Wed Jan 06, 2010 11:28 am

eeyu wrote:
Buck the System wrote:
imo, apm is.......get a better comp to handle the game quickly. super fast ram that is a "kit"

better parts means better responsivness. its silly to think a internet connected game has any justication in my view, but its true. APM means nothing online team games with crappy old door stop comps in the game.

He likes to deny what he cannot do Very Happy
highlight the dang stuff so we know wtf you are trying to say. Sleep its getting old.
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eeyu

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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:57 pm

Buck the System wrote:
eeyu wrote:
Buck the System wrote:
imo, apm is.......get a better comp to handle the game quickly. super fast ram that is a "kit"

better parts means better responsivness. its silly to think a internet connected game has any justication in my view, but its true. APM means nothing online team games with crappy old door stop comps in the game.

He likes to deny what he cannot do Very Happy
highlight the dang stuff so we know wtf you are trying to say. Sleep its getting old.
i thought it was perhaps common sense to remember your own post . . . =/ sorry memory does decay with old age
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PostSubject: Re: Sioux boom   Wed Jan 06, 2010 7:43 pm

eyesight Wink
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