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 Ottoman fiddling

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Sanderson_FIN



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PostSubject: Ottoman fiddling   Mon Jun 29, 2009 8:32 am

_Pi wanted me to record an Ottoman boom and I am also going to write it down as it is very similar every time.

fileden.com/getfile.php?file_path=http://www.fileden.com ottoz.age3Yrec

3 Starting vills go to hunt, 3 to crates. Build church as soon as possible and improve the first train speed (100w) it being ready before the tc starts to train it's second villager. All villagers and new ones to hunt, build a house. If you started with 4 wood crates you can build a market or not have it built*

First card is coin trickle, second card economic theory.

When you have gathered 800 food age up with 400 wood and start balancing your vills for next age up ( at this point about 7 on food and 5 on gold and start working it balanced from that)

When you have 1200/1000 age up with fast age up, ALL villagers on wood, two villagers to gather the 400 wood crates.
*If you had built a market, gather extra 100 food and improve chopping. You will not have improved anything else yet at this point.

Keep all on wood build two town centers. Then church improvements, first the 250wood villager train speed improvement. By now you will have the 200 gold from gold trickle needed to improve your settler limit from 25 to 45.

When you have 600 wood for the last settler train speed improvement improve that, build market *if not yet built and improve age1 food and gold improvements, build one house (to a total of 50 pop space) and balance your vills to food and gold for a fast industrial age up. This point is very crucial, because you have to gather the necessary 2000/1200 fast enough to have time to gather 400 wood and 400 gold for the villager limit improvement from church. Screwing that up would be pretty stupid. So when you are going on age up be brutal putting all your vills from food to wood to gather the necessary 400. *If you hadn't improved wood chopping yet, do it at this point.

When you are done with the villager limit improvement build one house and make the decision whether you want to improve age2 market food and gold. In a bad 3v3 position in Andes you may be out of herds at this point, and have to start making mills. When you have aged up, send factory and gather 1000gold crates for asap mercantilism. Put all vills on food and gold, improve factory for wood and when done with that put factory on wood. Your second factory should be arriving by now, put it on wood, too.

If you ran out of herds and built mills already at this point, you probably have to improve villager limit from 70 to 99 before you age up to imperial.

when aging up to imperial improve age2 wood chopping from market, and start going all mills. You will have sent your mill card at this point. You also have to decide whether you make cows or not. I nowadays hardly ever have the patience, but on this recording I make cows because of the british team livestock card.

Improve food from capitol and have 100 vills on food, factories on gold. Trade 50+ wood depending on the situation.
At this point build a plantation after the trade, improve it, and gold from capitol and. When done with the improvements, build 6-7 plantations and fill them with vills.

On the recording if you watch it you will see Brit Otto vs Brit Spain for a min and then Otto vs Brit for the rest of the game (due to simultaneous lag outs) Due to fighting by enemy walls and next to trade route I don't have the usual protection that buildings offer and have to make less abus and more hussar/cav. arch for anticav.
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Dr. Dreadloc
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Mon Jun 29, 2009 5:13 pm

I started playing ottomans a few weeks ago, and have used PI's boom, I will try this one out. My objective is to have a smooth boom at least between 1900 and 2k. I like to do so without the aid of using "quick fix" cards, but I keep in mind that ottomans do not have what I call an full "25 card deck" that are superior for a full 25. You really can not make a deck without a few quick fix or bogus cards that do not actually give ottoman additional strength. They are a very fun civ that has a lot of punch if used right.
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Brett

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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Mon Jun 29, 2009 6:55 pm

I tried out some of Fin's ideas, merged them with my own and got a very solid 2250 boom against a computer.

The major thing I did differently was that I did the first round of market upgrades in Age 1/while Aging to 2. I got Hunting Dogs before I started gathering food, as well as Gang Saw and got Placer mines while aging. That slows down my age-up to 3 by about 30-45 seconds, but I think long-term it's worthwhile.

Another minor change was doing the Age 2 wood upgrade while aging to 4 and the Age 3 wood upgrade in Imperial, in addition to the Capitol upgrade for wood.

I love seeing people's strategies and ideas though, because I get different thoughts from every boom.
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Tue Jun 30, 2009 2:49 pm

watched it and yea was good score but why wood trade lame. i just dont get it. you all know for a fact the wood trade boom will not beat a 30 30 50 eco.

id lose to sandy 7 of 10 times but i know my otto boom is more realistic. i think you got 2224 mine was 2204 no wood trade laming!
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Sanderson_FIN



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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:23 am

You never know how much wood you end up needing.
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Dr. Dreadloc
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:22 am

I rather have too much...than not enough....nuf said
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BedingBedang

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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:43 am

I am always a wood whore with Ottoman. As long as I am not passed 28 min to send the card, I will never have too much food to trade.

Having extra wood lets you keep facs on food and gold in tough, long draining games.
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Allbinx

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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:23 pm

i disagree with this actually. ive played with kerk numberous times where he has a huge score of 2500 with brits and im like, well ok he can feed us........ 2300 of that score is wood. -_-. you can certainly have too much wood, especially when u sacrifice other resources for having it. would is in fact the "limiting reagent" if u will in treaty games, however too much wood is the limiting factor in ur other resources.

having a "healthy" amount is much better Very Happy
unless u decide on spamming LBS or natives. you shouldnt have more than 30-40k wood stockpiled, keep ur facts on wood and u will be fine the rest of the game. rarely games last over 1.5 hrs.
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:29 pm

Allbinx wrote:
i disagree with this actually. ive played with kerk numberous times where he has a huge score of 2500 with brits and im like, well ok he can feed us........ 2300 of that score is wood. -_-. you can certainly have too much wood, especially when u sacrifice other resources for having it. would is in fact the "limiting reagent" if u will in treaty games, however too much wood is the limiting factor in ur other resources.

having a "healthy" amount is much better Very Happy
unless u decide on spamming LBS or natives. you shouldnt have more than 30-40k wood stockpiled, keep ur facts on wood and u will be fine the rest of the game. rarely games last over 1.5 hrs.

With British I usually trade around 9-10 mins left, for about 50-60K wood. After all my upgrades, if I trade around 60K, I start out with about 53-55Kish and if I'm not using natives, that can easily last pretty much all game.

At 40 I usually have 60Kish food (sometimes it's like 65K, but it varies), 50Kish wood and 20Kish coin (sometimes it's higher if I can trade earlier, etc). I usually score around 2500-2600, Kerk usually scores around 2600-2700, but for me having a sane distribution is more important.

With Ottoman I usually trade around 12 min, leaves me with about 20-30K unspent wood at 40, which unless I'm going native is plenty for otto. If I intend to go native I trade at about 11 min, giving me about an extra 10K of wood, which is plenty IMO.

Having an excessive amount, like Kerk's fucking nutty 80K unspent wood, is absolutely pointless IMO.
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:31 pm

yes. i agree fully. with british i can see 50k MAYBE 60k wood unspent. but ne more than that is stupid. its really a waste of resources. if u are going to waste them like that GIVE THEM TO ME!!! ; P
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:56 pm

Allbinx wrote:
yes. i agree fully. with british i can see 50k MAYBE 60k wood unspent. but ne more than that is stupid. its really a waste of resources. if u are going to waste them like that GIVE THEM TO ME!!! ; P

My primary reason for having around 50-60K unspent wood is that I can keep factories on coin longer before switching them to wood if I'm not using natives, which let's me amass some more coin during fighting.
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BedingBedang

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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 4:17 pm

Kerk said: ''With Ottoman I usually trade around 12 min, leaves me with about 20-30K unspent wood at 40, which unless I'm going native is plenty for otto. If I intend to go native I trade at about 11 min, giving me about an extra 10K of wood, which is plenty IMO''.


Dead on. Thats what I do word for word an it proven itself to be the best strat for me.
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Brett

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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 4:28 pm

BedingBedang wrote:
Kerk said: ''With Ottoman I usually trade around 12 min, leaves me with about 20-30K unspent wood at 40, which unless I'm going native is plenty for otto. If I intend to go native I trade at about 11 min, giving me about an extra 10K of wood, which is plenty IMO''.


Dead on. Thats what I do word for word an it proven itself to be the best strat for me.

KERK SAID? What the hell! I'm not Kerk!
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 4:50 pm

Brett wrote:
Allbinx wrote:
i disagree with this actually. ive played with kerk numberous times where he has a huge score of 2500 with brits and im like, well ok he can feed us........ 2300 of that score is wood. -_-. you can certainly have too much wood, especially when u sacrifice other resources for having it. would is in fact the "limiting reagent" if u will in treaty games, however too much wood is the limiting factor in ur other resources.

having a "healthy" amount is much better Very Happy
unless u decide on spamming LBS or natives. you shouldnt have more than 30-40k wood stockpiled, keep ur facts on wood and u will be fine the rest of the game. rarely games last over 1.5 hrs.

With British I usually trade around 9-10 mins left, for about 50-60K wood. After all my upgrades, if I trade around 60K, I start out with about 53-55Kish and if I'm not using natives, that can easily last pretty much all game.

At 40 I usually have 60Kish food (sometimes it's like 65K, but it varies), 50Kish wood and 20Kish coin (sometimes it's higher if I can trade earlier, etc). I usually score around 2500-2600, Kerk usually scores around 2600-2700, but for me having a sane distribution is more important.

With Ottoman I usually trade around 12 min, leaves me with about 20-30K unspent wood at 40, which unless I'm going native is plenty for otto. If I intend to go native I trade at about 11 min, giving me about an extra 10K of wood, which is plenty IMO.

Having an excessive amount, like Kerk's fucking nutty 80K unspent wood, is absolutely pointless IMO.

Brett you noob. I NEVER have 80 k unspent. My sources at 40 are usually this. c. 60k food, 80-90k wood, 5-10k coin. I'm always feeding the team like I'm the bank. So I'm always going to do a bigger trade in a serious game b/c I don't know how long it will be until my noob mates, esp you Brett, need something. : ) "Kerk I need food. Kerk I need coin, Kerk I need wood. Kerk I need extra units. " We should go ahead and program those into their own taunts for my teamates.

I've lost too many games b/c our team ran out of wood. For example, the game with you, me, and Wullf recently Brett. I had to dlelete 50 vills and feed you noobs adn we ran out of wood. This is why you ALWAYs play it safe then sorry. I never run out of food and gold I'm very good at balancing my eco. More wood helps esp if someone gets your factories.

Why use two mills if you can only gather 65k food and I can get c. 60 k without it? Its pointless IMO. Youré not maximizing your coin income and It means you aren't microing your livestock correctly. People who say "I'd rather have a good distribution" are really just lazy to manage their eco after the fight. My eco is FINE during the fight bc I manage it correctly and dont just stick a ton of ppl on mills. Why do that? You can gather way faster from plants. So why not just max your coin income and just keep cowing. Its laziness IMO : ) I have not once drained my eco down to nothing without feeding someone else.

BTW dread, nice work on this site. I love it.
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Allbinx

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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:05 pm

still if i was on ur team id rather u have 40k wood and 40k extra coin or food. than 80k wood. 80K RESOURCES MAN... THAT IS A TON
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Sanderson_FIN



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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Thu Jul 02, 2009 8:18 am

the guy without the shirt is right
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Thu Jul 02, 2009 10:56 am

if u using natives with brits i like to have alot of wood but 80-90k well ...... makes your score look good though
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Thu Jul 02, 2009 10:59 am

Allbinx wrote:
still if i was on ur team id rather u have 40k wood and 40k extra coin or food. than 80k wood. 80K RESOURCES MAN... THAT IS A TON

Don't play on my team then : )
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cmontuptim



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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Sat Jul 04, 2009 1:55 am

Lol

With ottos I dont think you would need a large amount of wood unless you were playing like a bitch and base spamming Smile
If you going to do that just play japs and be done with it I think...

Of course if you are playing a fun native map you would obviously want more...
Basketball
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Sanderson_FIN



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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Sat Jul 04, 2009 6:43 am

it's in fashion to use lots of mortars so "base spamming" turns actually to "having a base"
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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Sat Jul 04, 2009 3:59 pm

I would have more wood so that you definitely don't have to worry about it for the rest of the game, and can focus on great income for food/coin. Then again, I have a bad tendency to not get enough food with brits, so what do I know?
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cmontuptim



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PostSubject: Re: Ottoman fiddling   Sat Jul 04, 2009 10:27 pm

POM what I am referring to is constantly just spamming buildings one one side than the other when losing the fight...
Im aware its a fair/legal/etc tactic but its super gay if you ask me Smile
But Its just my opinion since I like head on fighting lol...
And moving lots makes my eyes hurt Sad
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